good saturday afternoon, i'm craig melvin. we are tracking the aftermath of the blockbuster snowstorm that socked the northeast. here's how it looked from space. check that out. right now the storm is being blamed for at least five deaths. about 650,000 homes and businesses do not have power right now. dozens of cars and drivers are still being rescued from the long island expressway in new york. meanwhile, in plum island, massachusetts, homes are in danger of being swept right into the ocean given the high tide, combined with the howling wind and snow. boston's mayor along with the governors of new york and connecticut are urging people to stay home. >> it's clear we still have a lot of work to do.

please stay home so we can allow our crews easy passage to the streets. >> stay home, please, unless you have urgent business to be out on the roads. >> this is going to go on for a number of days. this will not all be done today. >> no rest for the weary, not even news reporters. >> i thought i would borrow vicky's snowshoes to make this live shot easier. that was a big mistake. so i'm going to do the rest of this live shot sitting down. >> we are under two feet of snow. i can show you guys just how deep it is here and difficult. >> the big dig here has begun. >> we've got reporters standing by some of the hardest hit areas this afternoon. ron mott is in providence, rhode island. tim caputo from our boston affiliate is in massachusetts. what's the situation right now with particular in regard to transportation and power outages on there?

>> reporter: it is tough to get around and the stay home message applies in long island and governor chafee ordered everyone off the streets here and not everyone is heeding the warning, unfortunately, most people are, but there are a lot of folks out coming around and joyriders taking this all in. i spoke to one gentleman a few moments ago who said he got stopped by police and he had a carful of elderly people in the car taking them to warmer climates. one of the elderly people had their thermostat -- had no power and the thermostat was reading 42 degrees and the cops said that's fine, go ahead about your way. there is a mall here and it is mostly closed here, but there is a panera bread inside and the assistant manager and one of the employees they decided to make their way in today to make sandwiches for power crews and they're in there hard at work and we'll go down and get some video of them. what is going to happen over the next three hours and we have three hours left of daylight and

this is why they want to keep people off the roads is so the power crews and can get to some of those downed lines. at last check 170,000 residents are without power in rhode island. and that's a pretty significant number and a lot of them may not get power believe monday and tuesday. >> ron mott, good to hear about those workers doing some good. 170,000 without power in rhode island. tim caputo standing by in sandwich, massachusetts, more than 400,000 people do not have power in massachusetts. tim, what's the latest over there? >> i can tell you the conditions here have not improved in the 12 hours we've been standing by the water here in the town of sandwich. you might be able to see off in the distance behind me, a bit of the cape cod bay as we get closer to low tide. the winds have been sustained in the vicinity of 15 to 20 miles

an hour and you get gusts still going to 30, 40 miles an hour and the big issue here, though, the power is out for a lot of people in downtown and it's easy to see why. you see some of those power lines now sagging pretty close to the ground and they have a nice coating of snow and an icy mix on top of them. it has forced a lot of tree branches down and a lot of power lines down and certainly the road conditions are no better. you see it here. you can make out the double yellow line here, but plenty of slush and snow here the blizzard warnings have continued in cape cod and very low visibility and you can understand why conditions here are pretty bad and most have hunkered down since yesterday morning. >> i want to ask you quickly about a sad story we're getting from your station about a little boy in the boston area who died from carbon monoxide poisoning. what more can you tell us about

this? >> reporter: we know the family was shoveling out their driveway at the time up in boston. they got about 24, 25 inches of snow. the conditions not quite the same here as it is up there. so people are starting to clean up there. from what we understand the boy went to warm up in the car after doing a bit of shoveling, but because there was so much snow that car was covered in snow. we understand the tail pipe was kind of covered in snow as well so when they turned the car on and got it running there was obviously a concern there and the boy got carbon monoxide poisoning and was taken to the hospital where he was later pronounced. >> tim caputo from our affiliate whdh. thanks, tim. to politics now, first lady michelle obama is among the mourners remembering a 15-year-old chicago girl who died a tragic random death. leah pendelton was gunned down after participating in the

obamas' inauguration. "the new york times" topped its paper and we'll dig into the legal justification for drone strikes later in the program and president obama warning that the middle class will get hit hardest if congress does not do something to stop those massive cuts set to take effect march 1st. >> if the sequester is allowed to go forward, thousands of americans who work in fields like national security, education or education are likely to be laid off. democrats and republicans can still get together on a balanced solution to the deficit crisis. republican senator mitch mcconnell says that he know that sequestration would have consequences, but he blames president obama for not putting forward an acceptable plan to prevent it. for more on that, jonathan strong, staff writer, role call, alexander burns and national political reporter with politico. good afternoon to both of you. >> hello. >> outgoing defense secretary

leon panetta warned that the $85 billion in cuts would curtail american naval operations by a full third and could force furloughs of as many as 800,000 civilian workers. take a listen to what he said. >> it is difficult to believe, frankly, that congress would simply stand aside. stand aside, fail to make the decisions necessary to resolve this crisis and allow the defense economy, equality of life of america to be irreparably damaged. >> how damaging would these cuts be to our national security? >> it's a great question. the impact is going to be fairly dramatic to some of the employees, civilian employees of the pentagon and some other places. the 85 billion in cuts is through the rest of the fiscal year through september 30th and we're not even talking a full

year. it's 50/50 between the defense cuts and the discretionary am doestic spending cuts and the warnings that we're hearing from experts on national security are very severe and vehement. they have told us that this will be a very significant damage. >> let's put the list up here, alex. the white house put out this fact sheet yesterday on the most damaging effects of the cuts that are supposed to go into effect march 1st. 17,000 education jobs at risk. 70,000 kids being kicked off head start. nearly 400,000 mentally ill patients not receiving health care and small business loan guarantees being cut up to $540 million, roughly. the white house did not mention the massive military cuts. what was the strategy there? >> well, look. i think that for the white house, the strategy here is to emphasize that basically every american would be impacted in some way. if you emphasize defense cuts and i think americans if you

look at public polling have mixed feelings about the need for a big military and the need to put a lot of money into defense spending, but when you talk about issues like education, local public safety, energy programs and these test extraordinarily well in focus groups of middle class swing voters who with are exactly the kind of people that need to be there in the run-up to sequester and if it does take effect those will be the voters who decide who is to blame afterward. >> there is this 11th hour deal that's done because there are sides that are talking. i just heard a few minutes ago from molly ball with "the atlantic." the two sides aren't even engaged in conversation. is that accurate? >> yes, it is. in fact, speaker john boehner in the house has told his republican colleagues that he's only going to work on these issues through the regular order and there was a lot of -- there was a lot of division within the

republicans over him talking behind the scenes with president obama. they didn't entrust him to get a good deal. so now he said everything that happens between the two sides will be happening in public, and so if -- unless there's something we don't know about, that's what we have right now. >> alex, this week conservative columnist charles scott hammer wrote this in part, the republicans have leverage, they should use it. it was the president's idea in the first place. there's some question over just how accurate that is, but first of all, how much of an issue is this going to be in terms of the blame game that we have here? i think if sequester were to take effect it would be one of the dominant themes in the next year and a half, when they're happening in 2013, virginia which has a governor's race is a state that depends to an extraordinary degree on defense in military spending and the

issue that charles kraut hammer raise saturday cycle that we're stuck with now is just how much leverage do congressional republicans have with these big brinksmanship like the fiscal cliff and like the sequester in terms of being able to implement an agenda from a minority. >> politico's alexander burns. we'll come back -- we enjoyed it so much we'll do it again in a few minutes. we'll do it a little later in the show. >> he's on the cover of "time" magazine, dubbed the republican savior. senator marco rubio is set to deliver the republican response to the president's state of the union address, but he's facing stiff competition in having the last word. we'll tell you when is set to steal his thunder and coming up later, i'll ask the postmaster general himself what was behind the decision to end an american tradition and shut down saturday letter delivery. we'll talk about that and we'll also talk about what, if anything, can be done at this

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you are looking at hartford, connecticut where 22 inches of snow has fallen so far there. i want to bring you up to speed with figures from the storm. a state-wide traffic ban will remain in effect through today. about 645,000 customers throughout the northeast are without power. 415,000 of those are in massachusetts. boston where nearly 22 inches of snow has also fallen has just lifted its blizzard warning,

milford, connecticut, 38 inches of snow. ham den, 36 inches of snow. this is the second storm that slammed into the northeast and that follows, of course, in the wake of super storm sandy and it's left the entire corridor one big, soggy mess. joining us to make sense of this bill nye the science guy. good to see you. >> good afternoon. >> the storm today on a similar trajectory recently taken by super storm sandy, i and want to show these images, very similar images of the two paths. what's behind these massive storm systems in this particular part of the country? >> well, this particular part of the world. so you get storms that start in -- off the coast of africa and they make their way across the atlantic ocean and the nature of the spin of the earth and the pull of gravity makes these things get a little bit of pressure behind them and it pushes them northward. the thing is and as you

observed, both sandy and -- both the rainstorm and the snowstorm follow the same track. it's not a coincidence so when you're there, you may notice that the wind generally come from the northeast and the people in new england refer to it as a nor'easter. when you live on the west coast. i'm sitting right now in los angeles, that same type of storm is called a southwester, so if you go to the sail boat store you can get a nor'easter hat in new england, but if it's a souwester hat in seattle and that's because it has a counter clockwise mouth in the northern hemisphere. it is extraordinary, everybody, that the storm is so big. how big is it? it's so big that the difference in spin at the southern part of the storm versus the northern

part of the storm causes it to -- the spin of the earth. >> okay. >> causes the storm to spin and here we are. this could be the future, everybody. this could be the new normal. with all of the extra heat energy that's in the atmosphere, climate change, this could be the way it's going to be a lot. now people say it's a blizzard, how can it be global warming? well, the difference between snow and rain is very small. it's just a few degrees celsius. a few degrees fahrenheit. and when the heat surface has more heat impacted on it there's more evaporation and more moisture in the air and here we are. >> while i have you i want to talk about this asteroid that's coming dangerously close to us next friday? should we be worried at all? >> we should be worried, but not about this asteroid. this is 2012 da-14 which was discovered by my colleagues at

the planetary site. do you know, i have a day job now. i have the planetary site for people to look for near-earth objects so this asteroid will pass between us and the satellite that msnbc is using right now to broadcast this -- >> uh-oh. uh-oh. >> to send this message, this broadcast around the world or around the country. understand, this thing is about 45 meters across. it's about the same size as the one that made the big hole in the ground in arizona not too far from flagstaff. it's about the same size as the one that created the tungusta event. this is where the rock comes into the earth so fast that even the atmosphere acts like a solid piece of material.

okay. >> the thing bursts in the sky and destroys everything over about 200 square kilometers. 22 -- 120 -- rather, 1200 miles. square miles. if it lands over new york, paris or tokyo or atlanta. that's it. and now there are about 100,000 of these things that cross the earth's orbit as this one is doing. so we have to look out for them. >> but again, before i let you go, really quickly. we're not expecting that this time. >> not this time. absolutely not. >> i wanted to make sure. >> definitely miss and that's rocket science. thank you. >> bill nye, the science guy who now has a day job, as well. thank you. >> good afternoon. still ahead on this saturday afternoon a milestone during black history month, 250 miles above the surface of the earth. we'll stay in space. also what's seen in the movie "lincoln" prompted a connecticut

congressman to fire off this angry letter to steven spielberg. joe courtney is calling for major edits. you're watching msnbc, the place for politics. capella university understands businesses are trying to come

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the knowledge to go further in your career than you ever thought possible. let's get started at capella.edu all right. the super mayor cory booker can't be everywhere during a major storm so he puts his twitter page to work. booker will be posting advice to his followers as he tries to ride out this nor'easter as well like this one. yes. if that would help that was in response to a mother asking if the school would be shut down today. no, cancel your party. cancel your party and practice on dj hero if it was okay for he and his buddies to attend the party last night. >> to a political playground. the onion revealed two things about stephen chu. first of all, he's a pretty good sport and he may be quite the pick up artist. sort of. check out the onion headline.

hung over energy secretary wakes up next to solar panel and that's a pretty good picture. not true, of course, but chu posted this on his facebook page with this cheeky message. >> i want my decision to not serve as energy secretary has absolutely nothing to do with the faux scandal. and connecticut congressman not pleased with the factual error in the movie lincoln that put his home state on the wrong side, and he sent dreamworks studios telling him so. you know this. connecticut congressmen all voted to uphold slavery in the move. courtney says he couldn't believe his eyes and ears when he saw that and asked the congressional service for records turns out all four connecticut reps voted yes on the 13th amendment. the screenwriter admits the error and courtneyay press release seemed a bit, quote,

flamboyant. up next, you don't have to live in the east to feel the pain from the weekend storm. we'll go live to one of the nation's busiest airports, quiet as a mouse today and the ripple effect could be huge. a little bit later the young man who could potentially upstage the president on the night that he should own. we'll tell you what to expect when rising star marco rubio responds to the state of the union address and you're watching msnbc, the place for politics. [ sniffs ] i have a cold.

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we are gathered here today to celebrate the union of tim and laura. it's amazing how appreciative people are when you tell them they could save a lot of money on their car insurance by switching to geico...they may even make you their best man. may i have the rings please? ah, helzberg diamonds. nice choice, mate. ...and now in the presence of these guests we join this loving couple. oh dear... geico. 15 minutes could save you 15% or more on car insurance. we want to bring you up to speed on the developing story we've been following in california for several days. despite heavy snow the ground search has resumed for in big bear mountain for a disgruntled ex-cop hunting down lapd officers and their families, killing three, wounding another. officials at this point have had no sighting of christopher

dorner. we will, of course, keep you posted on any developments there in california as it happens. meanwhile, back east, people are still digging out of the storm that's absolutely slammed the northeastern part of this country. in the air, ripple effects of this blizzard are being felt across the world. more than 5,000 flights in and out of the northeast have been canceled or delayed. nbc's rahima ellis in laguardia airport. has it gotten any better there? >> yeah, craig, it has gotten better. there are people here getting through the security checkpoints and there are reports of flights having taken off. not a lot of them taking off. not a lot of them coming in, but that is so much better than what we saw earlier. i talked with a bunch of passengers who had plans to get out yesterday and many of them are understanding of what's going on and listen to what one passenger had to say to us about what they were feeling because of the storm. >> i'm ready to be warm again.

it's been very cold and we're not used to the snow and texas weather sounds nice right about now. >> reporter: they're trying to get back to texas. in fact, there is a flight scheduled to leave texas in 15 minutes and it says it's on time, so we are keeping our fingers crossed for that passenger that they make it to their destination. we've got a lot of work going on out here. 200 pieces of snow and removal equipment have been pushing that snow off the runways trying to make certain they get these planes up and running again, craig. >> rahima ellis on this saturday from laguardia. thank you. back to politics, the president has a busy week ahead. he'll give the first state of the union address and he has major initiatives to tackle, gun control, immigration reform and economic recovery just to name a few, but there's another big speech being given that night as well, the republican response. it's being delivered by florida senator marco rubio. we want to talk about it in the

war room. joining me now, former aid to president clinton, and former assistant to george w. bush. good to see you. >> keith, let me start with you. do we think there will be a main headline out of the president's speech? do we think there will be a singular focus? >> think it will be focused mostly on the economy and jobs? the president ran on that issue last year and what's happened is that since november we've gotten sidetracked talking about deficit reduction. we talked about the fiscal cliff until the end of the year and we're talking about the debt deals and we're talking about sequestration and none of these terms came up during the debates or the election. what people are concerned about is the unemployment rate which is 7.9%. they're concerned about what the economy will do in the future and we saw with the gdp numbers just last quarter. when the gdp started to decline in the last quarter and it was because the government was pulling back and they needed to spend money and they wanted to

reinvest in education and structure. >> you don't expect the president to call for additional spending measures on tuesday. >> he'll say we need to invest in making smart decisions and we need to make some cuts, too, but you have to do a balanced approach and republicans are proposing that we only cut spending and that's the recipe for economic disaster. that's the reason why sequestration according to economists will wreck and ruin our economy. we cannot afford to make that happen. >> let's talk about sequestration and it's an inside the beltway term. s there massive cuts, $85 billion worth of cuts. the president told democrats on thursday that he was prepared, eager and anxious to reach deals on sequestration and the fiscal cliff soon. what does he need to say in the speech that will let republicans know that he's serious about working with them? >> it would be great to hear some initiative where he really legitimately, beyond just the budget and spending, really

wants to work across the aisle. i think that's the one thing, of course, i'm speaking here as a republican strategist, but that's the one thing president obama is lacking is this big, signature item where he really pulled over a significant number of leading republicans, and if, you know -- >> is that the president's fault or is -- >> craig, i don't want to blame him. we can blame the republicans, but in order for him to make his mark on history and to change the democratic party, he's got to do that. >> i beg to differ. >> this is a president who is the first president in history to pass a universal health care reform plan -- >> with no republican votes. >> you talk about he won't go down in history and he passed the health care plan that democrats and republicans have been trying to do in four years. that was more right-leaning than richard nixon's proposal. the republicans have moved so far in the right they don't even

endorse their own proposals and this is a heritage foundation proposal and the republicans don't go along with their own side because barack obama is in favor of it. the idea that he needs to compromise to go down in history is baloney. i never said he needed to compromise. what i said is he ought to pick a signature issue. >> think about health -- think about health care. there is something he could have done and he could have pulled olympia snow and some of these very, very centrist republicans with him and -- let me give you a -- >> let me give you a second -- >> let's talk about immigration or something like that. >> i think immigration is absolutely one way he can work with republicans. >> i think there is a significant number for republicans and the senator who will give our response on tuesday who is becoming the leader of our party and i think there is good will not by the majority of the party to get the

signatures and i think it would be great for the president in terms of his accomplishments if we could get something that attempts to fix this problem. >> how concerned are democrats that marco rubio might steal some thunder from the president come tuesday night. he's a freshman senator from florida. he's not going to steal the president's thunder any more than bobby jindal did or anyone wo gave responses to the president in the past. this is what republicans have done because they've adopted the politics of symbolism. they lost the latino vote by 74% so why don't we get a latino guy to come out and speak in spanish and english to show that we really care about latinos. but we just heard a moment ago they're still not onboard on immigration reform. the idea that you can put up a latin face and the latino is going to suddenly not be aware of the policies of the party just doesn't make sense. >> matt, i want to play, and you

probably already heard the sound bite for our viewers. this is president clinton issuing a warning of sorts to democrats. take a listen. >> we should not give up on our ability particularly when these periods when we're not in the heat of the election to begin a conversation with people who are not as extreme as a lot of the candidates they voted for in the republican party that we could get to be for us. >> that was president clinton essentially there warning democrats to not take white people for granted. what do you think is behind that warning. >> from the context. >> that's kind of what with i glean from it. >> your interpretation on what president clinton was saying there, but i do think he was a master at reaching out to folks and although, i think a lot of us republicans always were worried that he would outflank us because he did it time after time after time, but he also did it by appearing to approach policy and trying to take

moderate steps. so he was able to peel back people constantly from the center, and i think it's a lesson that he thinks that in the second term obama needs to understand. don't think you will get there just with your own base. if you will get approximately see achievements in america, you have to get the middle and the people on the other side. i think it's the wiley old master telling people involved in politics today, you ain't going to get there just with the people you're sitting there in that room. >> what did you take from bill clinton's message? >> president clinton has always been a centrist, slightly left to the center, and he would support most of the ideas and proposals, president obama had his own stimulus and it didn't pass in his first term. he tried to repeal the ban and that didn't pass. so barack obama has actually fulfilled president clinton's

agenda. republicans love to, in hindsight go back and revise history and say bill clinton was a great president in some respects, but they hated him. they despised him. they tried to do everything they could to stop him including his wife and there's a lot of historical recidivism. >> big difference between these two presidents and president clinton and president obama and i talked to people that worked with president clinton as you did and they said one thing president clinton understood was he had to have economic growth to put forward the social spending he wanted to put forward. the real box president obama is in is until he gets this economy rolling he won't do the domestic policy initiatives he wanted to do. >> thanks to both of you. always a pleasure. >> thank you. >> we are getting ready to cover the state of the union on tuesday and it's tradition that in the speech the president says the state of our union is -- we want you to finish that sentence

this time around. here's mine, tbd. to be determined. submit that photo to us at facebook.com/msnbc and share it with us on twitter and instagram, as well. use the hash tag there #sotuis. and the major milestone in space on this day in history, that story next. ♪ ♪ [ female announcer ] switch to swiffer wetjet, and you'll dump your old mop. but don't worry, he'll find someone else. ♪ who's that lady? ♪ who's that lady? ♪ sexy lady ♪ who's that lady? [ female announcer ] used mops can grow bacteria. swiffer wetjet starts with a clean pad every time, and its antibacterial cleaner kills bacteria

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even shorter, however, spectacular pictures and a real milestone, astronaut bernard harris became the first african-american ever to walk in space. >> that was bernard harris, the first african-american to walk in space. as you probably know, it's black history month. ant woin brown made history when he became drag racing's first african-american champion. for brown his childhood dream has become his life's passion. >> antronbrown's dream started oil. >> i was changing the oil on my mom's car at 12 years old. my dad and uncle, they raced. it was just bred in me and that's where love came from. i used to go to these big national events and watch all my stars race. >> now the 36-year-old is one of those stars. >> it brought a tear to my eye after i won the championship to hear my father broken up like, you know, emotional and saying,

son, do you realize this is what i've dreamed about my whole life and we're living our dream through you. >> in november, brown became the national hot rod association's top fuel champ and made history. >> how many trophies do you have? >> 38 including the championship trove. >> and i'm going to assume the championship trove set massive one here. >> that's the big one here. >> he's the first african-american to ever win the title in the united states. >> you're running out of space. >> i'll have to build different walls. >> or stop winning. you can stop winning. >> that's not in our vocabulary. >> for decades, drag racing has been a magnet for adrenaline junkies because the five-foot hot rods run on fuels that is mostly nitroglycerin and can make speeds of 350 miles per hour. and it feels like someone is pushing the squeezing the life

out of you and you have to keep it right. >> the tv audience has grown, drag racing has not caught up with its southern-based cousin, nasc nascar. >> a pass down the race car is four seconds and in nascar is a three-hour race. and brown is the fresh, new face to help grow the sport. >> the media is attracted to him. the fans are attracted to him and he's really a star in the making. >> you want dad to make a wheelie? >> that's good. right? did you see him smile? >> antronbrown remembers when the days were not so bright. >> the days when you were close to being almost $1 million in debt and didn't have a house to live in. >> what happened in school today? >> he and his wife billy joe have a full house outside indianapolis. >> how proud of him are you? -- >> now here i go with tears. >> sometimes success turns people into different people.

they cannot remain true to themselves and they don't remain the same and he does. >> the champ still fills his own tank. >> step right in. >> and takes time to teach wanna be racers. >> this is on fuel right now so you're going to be good. >> let me tell you something, i can get used to this. >> i begged him to let me take it out and he said no. brown's short-term goal, of course, to win more championships and eventually he would like to make more history by owning his own race team. today is one of the last saturdays that we'll all be getting first-class mail at our door. the post office has decided that the service will have to be canceled to make up for budget losses. massive budget losses. coming up in our 4:00 hour we will have a rare one-on-one interview with the postmaster general himself, patrick donohoe will join me.

meanwhile, we'd love to know how you would fix the post office. tweet me, there it is right there @craigmelvin, one word. you can also post on my facebook page, as well. we could use some of your suggestions if they're not totally ridiculous or obscene we might use them on the air. in america today we're running out of a vital resource we need to compete on the global stage. what we need are people prepared for the careers of our new economy. by 2025 we could have 20 million jobs without enough college graduates to fill them. that's why at devry university,

we're teaming up with companies like cisco to help make sure everyone is ready with the know-how we need for a new tomorrow. [ male announcer ] make sure america's ready. make sure you're ready. at devry.edu/knowhow. ♪ ♪ but will it stay fabulous 'til 5 o'clock? it will if it's new outlast stay fabulous foundation from covergirl. what makes it so flawless hour after hour? primer, concealer and foundation, all in one. get the longwear that survives the 9 to 5, fabulously. new outlast stay fabulous foundation from easy, breezy, beautiful covergirl.

earlier this week republican strategist and fund-raiser karl rove announced he was forming a new group called the conservative victory project and it's a spin-off from his super pac that dominated the gop during the 2012 election. the group's mission is to help mainstream republican candidates win and keep far right fringe candidates from hurting the gop, but is the gop still buying what karl rove is selling? joining me to talk about that is alexander burns, national political reporter at politico. thanks for coming back, guys. alex, rove took a lot of flack

after the 2012 campaign when republicans, of course, lost so many races despite the hundreds of millions of dollars that he raised. one group found that he had roughly a 1% success rate with his attack ads. who from the gop establishment is still backing him, john? >> well, craig, if you look at the sales pitch that crossroads has been making over the last week, two folks that they would like to have funding this new conservative victory project, they are pointing to a series of weak candidate it is like todd aiken and missouri and richard mourdock in indiana as an explanation for all of the disappointments for all of the republican parties last cycle and it is not clear how many donors will be buying that and you have the different set of group like the talk for growth and the more ideological set of donors that it was more establishment candidates and more cautious, controlled and programmed candidates that were the bigger problem.

>> it prompted some conservatives former tea party candidate for senate, christine o'donnell, she emailed supportes, christine o donnel and tea party not to blame for gop's failures. does the new group draw a clear line in the sand between karl rove and the tea party? >> clearly, there are very significant divisions between these forces within the republican party, and i think the argument that the conservatives are making is that it's not just these very right wing candidates that lost. the republicans, a lot of the mainstream party-backed candidates lost, too. so i think that both of the asides within the debate are not coming to terms with the fundamental problems that republicans need to take on. alex, you reported that this new group said that it supports

republicans like pat toomey, marco rubio, cruise. is rove the architect, is he as powerful as he once was, how much would his group actually matter? >> craig, i think that will be the test of the next 6 to 12 months and i think there's been a lot of attention on karl rove individually and there's good reason for that. he's an important figure in the republican party and there's this sort of larger network of the people associated with crossroads and the former general counsel of the u.s. chamber of commerce and the network of major donors who were invested in this idea that the establishment that maybe more moderate candidates are the future and the best hope of the republican party in 2014. that whole web of people is really putting a lot on the line with this new project. it's rove, but it's the people around rove, as well. >> here's another thing. how surprising is it to see karl rove get back in the game so soon after the whooping that he took?

>> i'm sure he would make the case that despite the dismal results on election day that his group prevented it from getting worse. >> really? is that the argument? >> that is what, you know, people will say when you spend a lot of money and you come up short is that without that spending you would have done even worse, but the problem is it's very difficult to pinpoint which parts of the campaign architecture and infrastructure tend to help. it's difficult to get those metrics. >> yeah. >> politico's alexander burns. thank you, gentlemen. we have a whole lot to get to in our next hour. the storm, of course, that started as a major inconvenience is now deadly. two people have died in connecticut, two in new york. a young boy died a short time ago this afternoon in massachusetts. stranded drivers, abandoned cars and there's a travel ban from connecticut tomas mas. we are going take you live to the places that have been

hardest hit. >> also ahead. the one man who will try to overshadow the president the night that he gives his state of the union. he'll try, at least. there he is senator marco rubio and the war on the penny continues and it takes a piggy bank full to buy anything with it and the government loses money when making them what canada did and why we might copy them. ♪ ♪ [ lisa ] my name's lisa, and chantix helped me quit. i honestly loved smoking, and i honestly didn't think i would ever quit. [ male announcer ] along with support, chantix is proven to help people quit smoking. it reduces the urge to smoke. it put me at ease that you could smoke on the first week. [ male announcer ] some people had changes in behavior, thinking or mood, hostility, agitation, depressed mood and suicidal thoughts or actions while taking or after stopping chantix. if you notice any of these stop taking chantix and call your doctor right away. tell your doctor about any history of depression or other mental health problems,

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in that time there've been some good days. and some difficult ones. but, through it all, we've persevered, supporting some of the biggest ideas in modern history. so why should our anniversary matter to you? because for 200 years, we've been helping ideas move from ambition to achievement. and the next great idea could be yours. ♪ good saturday afternoon to you. i'm craig melvin. fallout from the storm now blamed for deaths of five people. long island was hit hard by the massive snowstorm. hundreds of people were trapped in the cold for hours overnight and into the morning on the long island expressway. in fact, some had to be rescued by snow mobile. local official, many of them say

they're surprised at the magnitude of the storm. >> this is a very difficult storm. i've dealt with storms a long time. i've been a town supervisor. if you're a town supervisor you do snowstorms and i've never seen anything like this one. >> new york is offering reinforcements from massachusetts and connecticut. in massachusetts, more than 400,000 homes and businesses don't have power. people there are digging out from between 17 and 28 inches of snow across the state. meanwhile, in connecticut, more than a dozen towns, more than a dozen got more than 30 inches of snow. my friend and colleague ron allen is standing by in hartford. there's been talk about the travel ban there. what can you tell us? >> reporter: we are hearing reports that the governor may lift it in the next hour or so. we just took a drive around outside of downtown hartford where we are now and where we've

been the the roads are pretty passable and we were struck by how many on and off-ramps are blocked and you can't get off the main highways. also, secondary roads are blocked and some officials in local towns are saying it could be tomorrow, sunday or even further before they can get plows from all of the roads. if they lift the travel ban, folks did go where they want to go and it's still difficult to get around out here and there's still a lot of snow on the ground. as you said, there are several towns reporting more than 30 inches of snow. overall, we're hearing that this is the second biggest snowstorm that this state has ever received averaging about some 22 or three inches for the most part and that's the reading at the airport where the official number comes in. there have been at least three apparent deaths caused by the storm. we learned of a man, body found under the snow and there was a report of an 80-year-old woman

that was involved in a hit and run accident who was dead and an elderly man that fell on his porch and struck his head. conditions are still, those are accident, of course, but overall the conditions are still very, very dangerous to be out here and even if they do lift the travel ban, it's going be cold, dark and easy and more treacherous to get around and fortunately, this is a weekend so most people don't have to get to work and hunker down and get to see what's happening. >> as you were talking there, we saw an emergency vehicle of some sort. local officials begging you to not be on the road. be safe. bill clinton warning

democrats not to be complacent. mr. clinton telling the democratic leadership conference that republicans will fight hard to win in 2014. >> but i think that we should assume going forward that the people who disagree with us honestly in our approach will not make it quite as easy to draw the contrast by the things they do and say as they did the last time. >> clinton spoke to the leaders of that retreat for more than 45 minutes to a wide range of topics. >> there could be a bipartisan deal on gun background checks. the a.p. reporting that four senators, charles schumer of new york, and coburn and senator kirk all moving forward. michelle obama remembering a 15-year-old girl who died a

tragic death. hadiy appendelton was gunned down after performing in president obama's inauguration. >> the state of the union address to ramp up public pressure gun control and an issue that will have a sharp divide on both sides of the argument. lynn sweet is with the chicago sun-times and the international and executive editor for "time" magazine and thanks for being with me on this saturday afternoon. >> mayors against illegal guns using personal appeals now to try to make their argument. they released an ad that went up over the past two days or so and it features a number of hall of fame football players, deion sanders, marshall faulk, emmett smith and meanwhile in the last few days, president obama has been flooding twitter with messages including this powerful one on background checks. >> 52% of americans said they

support stricter gun laws. this is a quinnipiac university poll. 52%. what can we make of the disparity. >> this is an example of the obama administration that this time, i think it is different this time and there's a persistent, patient ground game and it is being realistic and reasonable. it's background checks and high-capacity magazines and like the checks themselves it's only by a long and persistent groundswell and they're not overreaching. furthermore, the gang of four is an indication that the nra itself may be overreaching so i think you have what might be a watershed moment where the nra is not calling the tune on

government resistance. >> if that's all that comes out on this entire debate, is that a win for the white house? i think anything is a win for the white house after ignoring this issue four years straight and under the bush administration. if any kind of legislation will be a win because there's been so little done on it over the past 10, 15, 20 years. >> as we mentioned earlier. president obama will be making gun control at least part of the state of the union address on tuesday. earlier this morning you reported that a constituent there of illinois congresswoman whose son was shot to death last year will be a guest at the state of the union address. what's with the thinking here? do we think that personal appeals like this, do they work? it could, because part of what we're talking about here is the battle for public opinion to push some lawmakers over the edge and to supporting something if not the background check measure and the assault weapons. so democrats are teach trying to

bring a victim of gun violence at this state of the union. i wouldn't be surprised if mrs. obama doesn't have a guest in her box, too, to traumatize the need to have curbs in place that are more than what we have now, and certainly going to the funeral in chicago where it was a packed house in the church and every important local figure in chicago was there, plus valerie jaret and education secretary arnie dunk an went to the service to show the commitment of the administration to do something and this is another shooting that happened and this time just a mile from the home that president obama and the first lady have. so all of the public pressure you're seeing, an ad bringing people in who are victims to tell their story is part of the campaign to pass something. jim, a lot of this debate is the divide between urban america

with regard to how we view our guns, 93% of urban responders and 91% of the quinnipiac poll saying they support background checks. what is it about this aspect of gun control that seem to have such widespread appeal. >> i was going say, it seems so logical. and 1999 supported background checks and they haven't been able to explain why it is that he and the organization overall. they were firmly if support of background checks a decade ago and why did they change their opinion when it was so out of step with what the rest of the united states is thinking and it is a controversial issue. there are so many aspects that the people of the united states and urban respondents, it doesn't matter what the sex, race, creed or color think it is a great idea and that's what the obama administration is tapping into that while the nra and nra members have always been a very vocal, you could say minority

they're hoping to tap into the silent majority of people who want more common sense when it comes to gun control, gun laws. >> before i let you get out of here. i do want to ask you about jesse jackson, jr., over the misuse of campaign funds. what's next for jesse jackson, jr.? >> well, the next step would be to have the announcement from the justice department with some more specifics. my colleagues at "the sun-times" have reported that the deal may not include a deal over what kind of prison time to serve and he thought he might have done better with the judge. the next step was to find out the details and exactly what he pled to. we also need to know if his wife now former alderman sandy jackson will get caught up with some kind of charges pressed against her because she served as his campaign manager and drew a salary from his campaign fund

and is suspending from that fund that is at issue here. >> lynn sweet, chicago sun sometimes and we'll check in with you later. in fact, jim, i want to ask you about that cover in particular. it would be the republican savior cover. we'll talk about that in just a few minutes here. >> and you're welcome for the plug. coming up, as if "time" magazine needs it, right? you've heard more about drones this week than you have in your entire life. separating fact from fikdction. we'll get a reality check on the other side. these pictures leave us with no words. this is boston buried in snow right now. and it's one of the last saturdays that we'll ever be able to check the mail, folks. ahead in the next hour we'll talk to the man who made the decision to halt saturday service. i'll ask him what's behind it and we'll ask him how we can save our post office. the postmaster general state ahead.

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>> we only take such actions as a last resort to save lives when there is no other alternative to taking an action that will mitigate that threat. >> that was john brennan there. the president's nominee to run the cia and his confirmation hearing thursday explaining the administration's position on drone strikes. the obama administration's shadow program of targeted killings got exposure this week right her. michael isikoff reporting the story here on msnbc. isikoff obtained the government document that lays out the legal arguments to justify the use of drones to kill al qaeda suspects including at times american citizens. i want to go ahead and take a reality check now and the government's the mostly secret

drone program until now. joining me now, vicki duval, former general council on intelligence committee and former deputy legal adviser to the cia's counterterrorism center and kevin williamson, deputy manager of the national review. thanks so much for both of you being here. reality check here. >> polls show most americans have very little problem using drones against citizens turned terrorists. here it is right here. 79% of people approve using drones against americans overseas who are suspected of plotting terrorist attacks. what does this is a about us, kevin? >> well, it says that voters aren't to be trusted, but we knew that already. you can put the word terrorist in front of anything and scare the crap out of people and they say yes, let's launch rockets at them even if they're citizens. if i said drone strikes against bloggers. anwar al awlaki, he was the bin

laden of the internet, which was a different thing from being the bin laden of the real world. he was the guy that wrote things and published things and said things in favor of al qaeda, and he was never a guy that took up arms and never planted a bomb or anything like that and we killed him because of stuff he wrote and said. >> vicky, what do those poll numbers say to you? >> they don't really surprise me. i think those of us who have been vocal about the various aspects of the program don't quibble with the fact that there are dangerous people out there and we probably should be taking strong action against them including americans. the problem is that the president has been acting on his say so alone and those of his advisers and in our system we'd like to have a little bit better check of what's going on than just the say so of one branch of government. >> john brennan, his confirmation hearings on thursday says that american

citizens who know al qaeda know the risks. take a listen. >> any american who joins al qaeda will know full well that they have joined an organization that is at war with the united states and that has killed thousands upon thousands of individuals, many, many of them americans. >> but in this country, before someone is executed there's a trial. there's a trial questioning. there's the accused that has an opportunity to defend himself or herself. with these targeted killings, who gets to decide who gets killed and when? >> apparently it's the president. something that's important to point out. people on my side over the years have made unfair and sometimes crazy criticisms of president obama, but this policy is immoral. it's a direct attack on the nature of citizenship and the problem here isn't brennan or any of the president's appointees. it's the actual white house saying i'm the president and i can do this because i'm the president. >> but if we know someone is a

credible, imminent threat to this country whether they are american or whether they are someone who is from yemen, if we know that they pose a significant threat to this country, then why should we not act? >> the question of checks and balances and who do you trust? in the case of awlaki, he was not a threat. he was a prop gandist. and if he had a bomb in a suitcase or fighting in a fire fight in tora bora and someone gets killed, that's one thing. this is a guy who wrote and said things and was driving somewhere in a truck. this is not a battle. it's an assassination. >> vick, here's the thing, if targeted killings were a part of u.s. foreign policy for decades which many acknowledge they have, how is this different? >> targeted killings have not been part of the u.s. policy for decades. they were engaged in up until

the 70s, the congress stepped up and president ford put a ban in place and they only reappeared after 9/11 because of the threat we now find ourselves in. so they're not something that we are used to doing. we are used to killing people in war, but weir not used to sending secret operatives or secret drones around the world, naming an individual person and deciding he's worthy of death and killing him. that is new and post-9/11 stuff and president obama is the person who upped the ante on this. >> what happens when another nation acquires and uses the same drone technology that we've been talking about and they exercise little to no restraint? >> you don't need a drone. all you need is a rifle. this is the sort of policy that you can apply to any sort of situation. the technology is the secondary question and once you decide that you can kill people for whatever reasons you like including your own citizens

which to me is the real line that's been crossed here that's the important one. whether you use the drone and the rifle and the gallon of gasoline and a match, killing is killing and i think we can get past the antiseptic language, let's call it it is what. it's an execution and an assassination. >> why do you think we've adopted those terms? >> that's part of politics in the 21st century. we talk about revenue ines krooes instead of tax increases and targeted killings instead of murder by the state. >> we have eavesdropping on americans in this country. i'm sure you saw the "times" article this morning and why not use those courts to decide whether someone gets executed? >> i think it's a great idea and some of us have been talking about this ever since mr. awlaki's name got put on the list in 2010. the idea is for the other branches, congress to step in and set up some kind of structure and then hopefully it would be a judicial-type

structure on, and we're just saying that we don't have enough confidence that they're always the right decisions and we would like another check on them. the questions may be answered incorrectly and we should have killed people that would have been killed and the structure would give us some confidence that it's being done right. >> thanks so much for the reality check this afternoon. >> one of the more powerful women in politics caught snoozing on the job. this was no accidental nap. a new trend in workplace productivity. >> also eric kabtor with lawmakers changing their tune in immigration policy this week, but what does the new chairman of the house immigration subcommittee think? we'll ask the congressman straight up when he joins us live. because sleep is a beautiful thing™. ♪ zzzquil™. the non-habit forming sleep-aid from the makers of nyquil®.

all your important legal matters in just minutes. protect your family... and launch your dreams. at legalzoom.com we put the law on your side. and launch your dreams. why take exercise so seriously,when it can be fun? push-ups or sprints? what's wrong with fetch? or chase? let's do this larry! ooh, i got it, i got it! (narrator) the calorie-smart nutrition in beneful healthy weight... includes grains and real chicken, because a healthy dog is a playful dog. beneful healthy weight. find us on facebook to help put more play in your day. you are looking at new york's long island where police had to deal with nearly a hundred cars stuck on the long

island expressway. it's a major interstate highway. we want to bring you up to speed on the storm. it's still snowing in portland, maine. a record breaking 32 inches has fallen there. a ban on travel on connecticut's roads is set to expire at 4:00 this afternoon, we are told. nearly 615,000 people and businesses remain without power in the northeast right now. >> that's the latest on the storm and now there's this. arianna huffington took a nap for me this week. i knew you wouldn't believe me so i had someone snap a cell phone pic. she showed off two nap rooms that she insisted on installing in her network headquarters. her employees can sneak away and get middle of the work day shut eye on a pull-out couch and they can do it in a futuristic nap pod or do it in a wildly popular massage chair. it's a new growing breed of bosses who are encouraging

workers to rest and recharge. for a while, we've all known the work, work, work mantra puts us at higher risk of hypertension, diabetes, obesity and cancer, now a lot of companies care thanks to a harvard study that says sleepy workers cost businesses more than $63 billion every year. the dreary who drag themselves in apparently are aren't as productive as their eight-hour night counterparts. roughly a third of american workers sleep more than six hours a night. that means slower reaction timeses when you get to work. you don't remember things and not as creative according to experts and in short, we're all working around like zombies and not the cool walking dead kind, either. here's the thought. let's sleep eight hours a night and let's nap when we can, just nap 15 or 20 minutes, start a petition demanding a few of the nap rooms. you start it, i'll sign. coming up, forecasters said

boston would get nailed and we've got the pictures to prove it. hard to believe there are actually cars under those no drifts. also hard to imagine that they'll be back on the road any time soon, as well. same thing in providence, rhode island. we'll go live to him next and then we'll talk about the penny and could the penny got way of dinosaurs and vinyl records and yet government has a big incentive to drop them. you're watching msnbc, the place for politics. [ female announcer ] today, jason is here

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get ready for a lot more of that new-plane smell. we're building the youngest, most modern fleet among the largest us airlines to ensure that you are more comfortable and connected than ever. we are becoming a new american. to that developing story we've been following in california, the ground search has resumed in big bear mountain for this disgruntled ex-cop suspected of hunting down l.a. cops and their families, killing three and wounding two. police say christopher jordan dorner wanted to exact revenge on those who he blamed for his dismissal on the lapd. his family has cooperated with

authorities and we will keep you posted on any developments there in california as they happen. back to the weather now. we are just getting word that people will soon able to get back on the roads in rhode island, as well. nbc's ron mott is standing by in providence. what's the latest, good sir? >> reporter: hi there, craig. you know, i'm standing in the middle of francis street right across from the statehouse and i don't know how much longer they'll let me stand here because in a half hour governor chafee will open the roadways of the state back open to people and that should give them about an hour with some daylight to get to the grocery store and the drugstore and places they want to try to hit before the light goes away. it will be very dangerous driving out here even if the streets look clear, there may be black ice out here. i should be on the sidewalk and it's underneath this drift, if you will, craig, probably 48 inches of snow that the crews have been pushing this snow up against the sidewalk here. they're trying to ask people very kindly, if you don't have

to be out, don't come foout for pictures and joyriding and they're here to help to try to get the lights back on for people who will probably spend the next two nights or so without power. 170,000 customers without power. the temperatures will get down into the single digits with windchills going below zero, craig. we're thinking about those folks going into saturday night into tomorrow. back to you. >> ron mott there in providence, rhode island. thank you. >> okay. >> to politics, now. >> it's becoming a similar thing on the hill. he's changing his or her mind on immigration this week. eric cantor making noise by voicing support for the dream act. >> one of the great founding principles of our country was that children would not be punished for the mistakes of their parents and it is time to

provide an opportunity for legal residents and citizenship, for those brought to this country as children and know no other home. >> joining me now from spartanburg, south carolina, good to see you. >> greetings from south carolina where you have many fans and friends, craig. >> my alma mater there in spartanburg. >> let's start here with mr. cantor. we should note here that he will be on meet the press and he flips his position on the dream act and you've been cagey in the past on where you stand in the dream act. can you tell us right now whether you support a path to citizenship? >> path to citizenship for children who were brought here before, say, the age of 18,

sure. >> i don't know how cagey i've been in the past. i think it's more of a reflection of -- and to eric's credit, i think when you are confronted with facts or new information or new evidence, i think it's a plus when people change their mind. so i give people credit for evolving. >> have you evolved at all? has there been any new information that has changed your mind on immigration? >> sure, and that process is continuing. we've had one hearing and two days ago i sat down and wrote down 25 potential hearing titles and sent them to our chairman bob goodlat and every time we have a hearing i learned something i didn't know. sometimes i have a position that's reinforced. i think castro was a phenomenal witness, but at least it starts a dialogue. >> 1986 is the last time there was a real effort to resolve

this, to fashion a remedy and it's been almost 30 years so i think the tone and people's intensions and certainly the tone is very constructive. that does not mean that everyone is going to agree at the end of it. one of the dominant issues was whether or not it has to be citizenship at the end of every one of those paths. >> if it's not citizenship, what is it? >> legal status. you can work here legally, for instance, some polls indicate 40% of the folks working in certain spectors now don't want citizenship, so why in the world would you force citizenship -- >> what poll is that, congressman? >> i can't state the name of it, within agricultural workers when asked do you want citizenship or work legally. they said i want to work

legally. >> in the past they said deporting all 11 million illegal immigrants would require government action that would shock the conscience of some of the folks who were most forceful in arguing for it. you know you are not one of the folks who believe in self-deportation. you've said children urn the age of 18 are fine with them staying. are you saying now that if you're over the age of 18 then perhaps it's not a path to citizenship, but it's a path to what you've describe sfd. >> well, you would have made a great lawyer, craig. you asked me about citizenship and i have no issues about citizenship for the dream children and that does not mean you don't want everyone else deported. there's citizenship after a background check with a pretty arduous set of conditions precedent. there's legal status where you don't desire citizenship. there's reunification of spouses.

those 12 million are not homogenous. you can have different silos or categories for those 12 million. i can answer the question, who are the 12 million. >> what do you mean, who are they? >> what do you mean who are the 12 million? >> well, half of these are overstays. so would you have a different analysis for a visa overstay than you would for a spouse of someone serving in afghanistan or iraq. i would. i would bump the spouse up to the head of the line. someone who is a visa overstay might be a differentanalysis. >> as these hearings continue i would love for you to come back and continue this conversation from time to time. >> i would love that. >> we'll get you to wear a gold and black tie instead of that clemson tie. >> i would love that. >> thank you so much, sir and be sure to catch "meet the press"

when david gregory will interview eric cantor and dick durbin on nbc. you know those one-cent coins that were fun to play with as a kid and weigh you down as an adult this week? canada dropped pennies from its currency. the canadians did it first and they said the things are basically too expensive to make. will we follow suit here in the united states? joining me now with his two cents, "time" magazine writer, we couldn't resist. you studied this topic and other numbers from the u.s. mint. how much money do we lose on the production of pennies? >> the thing with the penny is it costs two cents to make each one of of them. we're losing about $50 million making the penny every year. >> is there a lobby out there that's protecting the penny? >> there is a lobby and that's one of the main renes that we still have the penny. the zinc industry, the penny is

actually made out of mostly zinc, a little bit of copper and the zinc industry funds americans for common sense and it's a lobby group in washington that is fairly powerful and keeping the status quo and keeping the penny around. are there other coins besides the penny that are expensive to produce, as well. >> that's the one argument that acc makes, americans for common sense. it resonates. if we do get rid of the penny we could be more reliant on the nickel and use the nickel more and with the nickel it costs ten cents to make each nickel. so if we get rid of the penny it almost seems logical, why wouldn't we get rid of the nickel. >> how would we pay for things that are oddly priced? >> well, we can still use the penny as a price point. >> okay. and so the thing is if we use credit and debit cards which most people are doing anyway and mobile payment, costs would

still be to the penny, but if we were using cash, it would round up or down, depending on how close it was to the nickel and the five cents. >> thanks for coming in to talk to us about it. >> thanks. coming up, more than half a million people without power and the majority of those folks in massachusetts today, and the forecasters' warnings came to fruition. this was a bad one mp massachusetts, rhode island and connecticut, drivers were ordered off the roads and many of those who had ventured out, they paid the price. highways littered with abandoned cars and trucks. live coverage on msnbc. ure happ? by the armful? by the barrelful? the carful? how about...by the bowlful? campbell's soups give you nutrition, energy, and can help you keep a healthy weight. campbell's. it's amazing what soup can do. campbell's. when you lost the thing you can't believe you lost..

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global scope, at least of these u.s. drone strikes. i want to bring in the graduate student of new york university, thanks for coming in, sir. you developed an app, last summer, i understand, for the iphone that tracks drones and it was called, what? >> it was called drones plus. and it began from a question. even if we have access from this data and information about u.s. drone strikes, do we want to be interrupted by it? do we want to be as connected to our foreign approximately see as we are to the smartphones. >> and apple blocked that? >> three times. did they give a reason? >> the first two times it was excessively crude or content because it was literally publishing news stories. >> we did reach out to apple and we asked for a comment and we have not heard back from them. >> why track drone strikes? >> i think i was interested in this data set, right? because it's more than just a human data set and there are

stories with people and i sincerely didn't know the contorts and i wanted to learn more and i started reading the news articles ever since 2002 when the first weaponized drone strike happened in dwremen and it's been quite arresting to read through all of these and hear the stories of people who died. senator fieinstein from my home state of california said that there have been single digit casualties of civilians and if you read through the drone stream, the twitter account, it was quite arresting and quite hard to believe. do you get your information from news articles and how you get the numbers. >> bbc, the reputable news sources. >> let's talk about the twitter feed called drone streak and you have more than 20,000 followers. have you been surprised by the interest? sorry surprised and i started the twitter account expecting no one would follow it. that was the point, and have

this interrupt our day. at the same time there's this tendency to want to fetishize drones. >> what do you mean? >> drones are a hot topic. people are talking about them, and jeremy says we should talk about the targeting program. cruise missiles kill more than drone strikes and they're more of a targeted killing. >> creator of at drone stream on twitter and also creator of an app that heretofore has not seen the light of day. so keep us posted. let us know if they decide to pick up the app, okay? >> thanks, craig. today, one of the last saturdays that we'll be receiving first-class mail at our door upon. the post office, as i'm sure you've heard has decided that the service will have to be cancelled to make up for some massive budget losses, coming up in our next hour, the one-on-one with the postmaster general. meanwhile, we'd still leak to

meet, me, i'm craig melvin and there it is right there and i'm going to get a new headshot, too. we may want to use one of your suggestions on the air if it's clean and appropriate. got a dar. ♪ repair six months of damage in just one use. introducing the new pantene repair & protect system. damage effects are visible. the pro-v system repairs six months of damage in just one use. ♪ for hair that's silky smooth... all season long. ♪ new repair & protect from pantene. hair so healthy it shines. the blissful pause. just before that rich sweetness touches your lips. the delightful discovery. the mid-sweetening realization that you have the house all to yourself. well, almost.

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>> welcome back, live pictures here, it's a picture from boston, the city hit with more than 21 inches of snow. streets not passable. we will bring you up to date on the storm. boston's mass transit system will be closed until monday at the early yeft, boston on logan airport is set to reopen at 11:00 tonight. bradley airport is remaining closed, the situation will be reevaluated at 6:00, two hours from now.

roo rhode island's ban will be lifted. and connecticut as well are removing the ban. i believe we have a live look at hart ford, connecticut, you see there's folks starting to get back out on the streets. that car we just saw in front of the snow plow is about 9 minutes ahead of the travel ban being lifted. you see folks there starting to make their way around as the dig-out begins. some 600,000, more than 600,000 homes and businesses across northeast are in the dark right now. back to politics. president obama not the only person giving a in anticipated speech. florida senator, marco -- rubio will be delivering the gop's response to the state of the union.

it's the first time it's going to be given in two major languages. back with me now. my guests. is jim, let's start with you. >> okay. >> you have senator rubio on your cover, he is on the cover, the headline, the republican savior. >> that is right. >> there it is. he fired back. senator rubio fired back using a tweet thursday saying quote, there's only one savior, and it's not me, #jesus. >> there's more than one definition for the word savior, it does not just mean the man that came to save all mankind. >> you like to sell magazines. >> yes, and the fact that rubio himself got involved in the discussion is fine. what we were trying to say, after the last election. the republicans obviously have a

problem. and rubio is the best guess right now for them to solve the problem. foremost is the real problem that the republicans have with the spanish speaking population. a lot of what we were talking about in the story was that rubio may be the man to save the republican party, he has common sense things to do say about immigration and he may appeal to a hispanic vote. >> rubio will touch on immigration, but only in the context of how to grow the economy. why not use the forum to be more vocal about immigration reform, especially since, again, he is giving the speech in spanish as well? >> well, one of the reasons is, is that it's -- since it's the rebuttal of the state of the union and it's presumed that obama will talk about more than immigration, senator rubio is

already out front on that. he is part of the senate gang of 8. one of the four republicans on it. since he has identified with this issue, it gives him, craig, a bit of an opportunity to spread his wings and show his stuff talking about other subjects. >> here is another thing. rubio will give the response, as has been the case. there's a response response. rand paul will be speaking for the tea party. are we to now assume that marco rubio no longer represents the tea party interests? >> no, that is what the article gets into. he has not run away from more of the republican tea party, you know, radical, fiscal conservatives, or supposedly conservative issues like the debt ceiling and fiscal cliff. he is still right in there with more of the highbound tea-party issues. whether it's rand paul or paul ryan for 2016 and i know people want to throw up when they start

thinking about 2016 already, but there's a new generation of republican leaders that are jockeying for position and he is a moderate on certain issues. >> i want to put up your magazine cover, and i want to put up your international cover as well. this is -- this is the international cover here. marco rub yo and the next america. no savior mention here. >> we chose that cover line, because, yeah, the switching that is going on right now. we did not think that marco rubio was a internationally famous figure, the way that he is a nationally famous figure. and we wanted to highlight the long-term demographic trends that is taking place in the america. where it's more multi-culture society. one more finally tuned to immigration. that is something that "time" can do as a global brand. >> we will go with that explanation. >> that is the explanation.

>> i appreciate you both. good to see you, thank you for coming in on a saturday. a lot to talk about in the next hour, including the megastorm, it has left boston frozen in time. cars are buried. parts of new york, and rhode island, the latest on the blizzard of 20 hirn next. and you know, it's bad when even the mailman cannot get out. we will ask the post master general about the suspended service and the storm and we will spend a lot of time talking about about the suspension of saturday coverage and what he will do to save our post office. that is coming up. surgery was successful, but he will be in a cast until it is fully healed, possibly several months. so, if the duck isn't able to work, how will he pay for his living expenses? aflac. like his rent and car payments? aflac. what about gas and groceries? aflac. cell phone? aflac,

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[ male announcer ] make sure america's ready. make sure you're ready. at devry.edu/knowhow. ♪ >> good saturday afternoon to you. coming up the very latest to blizzard of 2013. the storm has left six people dead, and 645,000 without power

from maine to pennsylvania. let's go to providence, rhode island where the travel ban has just been lifted. ron, do you see cars on the road? >> absolutely. it's like they heard the call. ladies and gentlemen, start your engines, the state police came by to tell us that they would like to kindly ask people if they do not need to be out tonight, don't come out. because a lot of the roads may look passable, after the sun goes away, a lot of the roads will quickly freeze back up, because the temperature is expected to dip into the single digits tonight and we want to keep people away from the power you crews. we have power crews as far away as michigan, ohio, tennessee the, kentucky, trying to help get the power back on, for folks that will spend probably the next two nights, maybe three nights in the cold and in the dark here. 170,000 or so customers to national grid without power, that is more than a third of the

customers here in rhode island, it's a significant hit in the state. the governor and other state officials will hold a news conference at 5:30 to update the people here in rhode island, what they are asking, the mayor is asking people to please shovel the sidewalks. they are public rights of way to get through neighborhoods. while there's still light, they are hoping people will do. that clear out the fire hydrants so if they have trouble tonight, the firefighters can actually get to the high hidrants, people looking to see how quickly they get back to normal here. >> we have seen a number of folks behind you getting back to business as usual. a handful of cars starting to make their way around the streets of rhode island. >> thank you, sir. you bet. first lady, michelle obama is among the mourners remembering a

15-year-old chicago girl that tied a tragic death. she was gunned down a few days after participating in the inauguration. the president today spoke about the economic threat to the middle class if congress does not do something to stop massive spending cuts. set to take effect march 1st. >> if the sequester is allowed to go forward, thousands of people that are allowed to work in education, are likely to be laid off. >> the president said he believes democrats and republicans can still get together on a balanced solution to the deficit crisis. and as we have been discussing there's talk of creating secret courts in d.c. to approve drone strikes. the "new york times" topped their paper with the headline. drone strikes part of a public hearing on what had been very secret practices in this country. talk of torture and deadly drone attacks dominated brennan's

confirmation hearing. he defended the use of drones against terrorists. >> we only use drones to save lives when there's no other alternative to taking an action that will mitigate the threat. >> i want to bring in retired armiy colonel jack jacobs. good to see you, colonel >> good to see you. >> should it be the president or someone else in the chain of command, a secret court similar to the one that deals with wire taps that the "new york times" talked with about today, who should approve it? >> i don't want to see the courts involved. they make enough trouble already. it's a military exercise and that means the military should be in on it, including all the way up to the president of the united states, who is currently the person that makes the decision that the strike will be launched.

i would not like to see this, this authority delegated down to lower levels of the chain of command, i think that is a bad idea. >> why? >> the top of the food chain -- well, because as harry truman, the buck does stop there, the desk of the president of the united states and i would like to see the president retain the decision making capability and not get lazy and give it to some generals to decide. >> let's talk about john brennan for a second, it did not seem like he gave senators too much information at thursday's hearing. will that work out as a plus or as a minus for him? >> i think it will be neutral, actually. this was mainly political theater. almost everything that they were talking about was in the realm of levels of classification above top secret. so, he was not going to talk about anything of substance there. it was mostly political theater and a lot of the information

that senators need to know about this, they already know from secret session, if there's anything more than needs to be divulged by brennan, that can be done in closed session. with the press there, you will not get information out of him. >> it was all for us. >> it was all for you. >> he was sqasked about water boarding. i want you to hear about that. >> my question is this, in your opinion, does water boarding constitute torture? >> many people have referred to it as torture. >> do you have a personal opinion that water boarding is torture? >> i think it's something that should not be done. >> why do you think that he was not willing to go so far as to say that water boarding is in fact torture? >> he probably did think it was, but torture means different things to different people. water boarded, i have been water

boarded myself. it's very unpleasant. but knowing that i was probably not going to be killed, it had a different effect on me than it may have been on somebody else. at the end of the day. i think the government will rely on the on following. if it's, if it's going to save lives, we want the information and we are willing to do just about anything necessary in order to get it. it doesn't make it right. but the -- the results are the most important thing. why and when were you water boarded. >> during training? >> so that we know exactly what water boarding was all about? and this was, i got to tell you, it's, many, many, many years ago. >> quickly, chuck hagel, a vote of his nomination postponed this week. senate republicans saying they need more time, and more financial information. they said that the gop action was unprecedented saying that in part, the committee cannot have

two different sets of financial disclosing standard force one nominee and then one for senator hagel and one for other nominees. what is going on with the hagel nomination? >> if it sounds like a jury asking for more information for the judge after it's sequestee- after it's sequestered to make a decision. that is what it is. they are acting exactly like a jury. this is a great deal of political theater. i heard from a number of people who think, fairly certain that hagel has enough votes to get confirmed. >> yeah. >> but it's not a sure thing and especially since his weak performance in front of the committee last week. i think they will make it as difficult for him as they can. >> last question, president obama, among those honoring leon panetta yesterday in an armed forces tribute. what is going to be mr. panetta's legacy? >> cutting -- cutting the

budget. he was -- he is a budget cutter from the very beginning of his political career. he was sent there to cut the budget, to do a lot of things but mostly to cut the budget. and he leaves a legacy of having prepared the pentagon to reduce the expenditures during a time when it has to do that one aor the other. >> we appreciate your time. even when you are traveling. thank you. >> coming up. her husband has one and she will have to beat out a former president to get hers. we will tell you what michelle obama could win tomorrow night. first up. we will talk to the man who made the call. to call it quits for saturday delivery, up next, post master general, patrick donahoe, and why he had to make the call. and if it will save the storied american institution. you are watching msnbc. ♪ alright, let's go.

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you are looking at the latest pictures from new york city, the city was actually spared the brunt of the storm, but there's still cars buried under know in the outlies areas. there's 38,000 connecticut residents without power, and new york commuter rail lines are back in service in massachusetts, rhode island, connecticut, they have all lifted travel bans there as well. it's the end of the era and could be the beginning of the end of an institution. to try and save money the postal service announced beginning august, it will end saturday delivery service. the post office lost $16 billion

last year alone. the news took many by surprise. but it was shocking to find out that the post office has managed to last this long says "the daily show." >> sorry, where do you want me to take that? hawaii? no problem, you got a quarter, i will get it there in two days. >> i want to bring in patrick donahoe, post master general of the united states. good to see you, sir, thank you for coming in on that saturday. before we get to saturday delivery and how we can save the post office. let's start with the blizzard in the northeast. the storm forced a number of post offices to close today. what kind of effect has the storm had on you guys and when do you expect it to get back to normal? >> we will see what happens over the weekend. we toly the instructions that we get from the local people in charge and they told us stay off the street. so hopefully we will have a bit

of warm weather to melt it and we will be back in business on monday. >> let's talk about the post office, senator harry reid said you need approval from congress to halt delivery on saturday, how do you make the change without them signing off on the plan? we have an interpretation of the plan that means we can move ahead. there's people with other opinions. the good thing is this, the current budget resolution expires at the end of march. that gives us six weeks to work it out. what i ask congress to do, eliminate the restrictions so we can move to six days of package deliver and five days of mail delivery. >> how much does it save? >> $2 billion. we will have post offices open on saturday and we will deliver picture

packages. door to door delivery of letters will go away. >> there's been talk that e-mail caused mail to drop. but there's the talk that the congress has had just as much an affect on the post office. what can congress do to save the post on office? >> here is our situation. we've lost 60% of stamped mail. you put in the mailbox, because people pay bills online, it's easy and free. you cannot argue. that the other thing we need congress to do is move ahead on legislation on things that we cannot change. we have to reform the health care. we would like to have our own health care plan. it would save us $7 billion. not just the $2 billion here. and a few other things to give us more flexibility to get in more markets. >> let's talk about what a lot of folks think may be the biggest hurdle for you guys. can you explain for our viewers

in the simplest of terms what the prefunding retirement benefits have done to the post office. >> here is the way this works. in two now and six, congress passed allow -- in 2006 congress passed a law for us to free fund the retiring benefits. we want to do that, but instead of spreading it over 40 years, we had to do it in ten years. the volume dropped, between e-mail and people paying bills on line. we have half, we have $50 billion in, we have to change the way we are paying it. it has burdened us. >> my father retierped from the postal service -- retired from postal service after 44 years. helped my family rise to the middle class. it was pointed out how cuts can impact minority communities. take a listen. >> this is reduction from five days to -- from six days to five

days, will cut anywhere from 25 to 30,000 employees. and with regard to asians, african americans and hispanics, they make up about 40% of the postal service employees. >> how can the postal service reduce the impact of any cuts on these communities especially? >> here is what we have been doing. before i move off of that, tell your father, thank you for his service and congratulations. here is what we are doing. we anticipated this. the postal service had to reduce the head count, about $300,000 people over the last ten years. we knew it was going to happen. we are proud that as we made changes nobody has gotten laid off. >> you used attrition. >> yes, and overtime. we have had the discussion of 20,000 people plus. but most of it is overtime. we will shrink the over time, we've been allowing people to

retire and that is not having a big disruption in their lives. >> what about turning the post office into a general store of sorts for the 21st century. why can't we go to a post ovrs and you know, buy a prepaid cell phone or go in a post office and buy a cup of coffee. why not turn the post office into something bigger. >> there's a lot of people that would be mad if we sold cell phones and coffees. here is what we are doing. the reason we are delivering packages on saturday is because package growth is booming. 14% up in the last two years. 17% christmas this year. year over year. big, big growth in fact, you will see in some areas we will be delivering packages on sunday starting soon. that is a big innovation. the other thing that you see, is the world of secure and secure digital messages. we are getting into that, people tell us, the same thing you can do from a hard copy, sealed

against inspection, we need that in the digital, e-mail world. there's a lot on the table. we have to get the negative finance behind us in the rear view mirror so we can focus on growth. >> sunday package delivery. that's the first time i heard of that. >> yep, it's going to happen. >> when is that going to happen? >> it's going happen soon. i'm not telling you anything else. just watch for your letter carrier in your neighborhood. >> before i lit you get out of here -- before i let you get out of here. t hash tag, save the usps, it was out there yesterday. how much can the public opinion affect the debate here? >> the public has been weighing in. we have taken surveys . 70% of americans have said, the do not let the postal office be a burden on the taxpayer.

if saturday delivery has to go, let it go, we heard customers say deliver packages on saturday if you can. i think you will see sur rays that have a higher percent that way. the american knows we have to change. and we have to change in order to stay relevant and that is what we are trying to do. >> patrick donahoe, post master general. thank you, appreciate your time on this saturday. >> thank you. >> up next, who hasn't he called a loser at this point. donald trump at it again, this time he is picking on a star from his own political party. who drew trump's ire this time. political playground and live to the storm front, where this is a familiar scene, unfortunately, cars stranded along the road, we will bring you the latest. stay with us. and i quit smoking with chantix. when the doctor told me that i could smoke for the first week... i'm like...yeah, ok... little did i know that one week later i wasn't smoking.

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playground. donald trump is not impressed with the moves to pick republican candidates. trump tweeting, rove is a total loser, money given to him might as well be thrown down the drain. his choices were the worst i have seen. the super pac released an ad going after ashley judd. a representative of ashley judd said she appreciates the attention and she that is a mailing list on her website so those who sign on will be the first to know, well, all sorts of things. we are getting ready to cover the state of the union here on tuesday, and it's tradition at some point, the president's speech, he will say, quote, the state of our union, insert a word. mine is tbd, the state of the

union is to be determined. take a photo of your word and send it to us. you can share it with us on twitter and instagram, up next. the latest on the search for that suspected cop killer high in the california mountains. also, the he very latest on the monster of a storm that socked the northeast and left it under self feet of snow. and whose is lady's choice? president obama or is his former secretary of state, new poll numbers, giving us serious insight, we will dig into those with the brain trust. you are watching msnbc, the place for politics. it's not for colds. it's not for pain. it's just for sleep. because sleep is a beautiful thing™. ♪ zzzquil™. the non-habit forming sleep-aid from the makers of nyquil®.

>>. great, everybody made it.

we all work remotely so this is a big deal, our first full team gathering! i wanted to call on a few people. ashley, ashley marshall... here. since we're often all on the move, ashley suggested we use fedex office to hold packages for us. great job. [ applause ] thank you. and on a protocol note, i'd like to talk to tim hill about his tendency to use all caps in emails. [ shouting ] oh i'm sorry guys. ah sometimes the caps lock gets stuck on my keyboard. hey do you wanna get a drink later? [ male announcer ] hold packages at any fedex office location. we want to go ahead and bring you up to speed on the developing story that we have been following in california, the ground search resumed for a disgruntled ex-cop he has killed three and wounded two.

the l.a. chief called christopher dorner an injustice collector that never lets go and they felt he would turn himself in. to boston for the latest of the storm that left the state of massachusetts in a soggy mess. the weather channel's eric fisher is standing by. eric, we are hearing that buses and trains could be sus pended all weekend there, is that also what you are hearing? >> it's a very good likelyhood. they are attempting to get things going. they thoep get some of the trains running. monday probably the target to get full service back to the area. the subway system is half above and half below ground. it's the above ground tracks that are the biggest issue. there's snow banks here unlike they have seen in years. we are up with the street lights, above the bus stop ta

station sign. we have had 29 inches of snow. in terms of travel at the airport, they have got 11:00 as a target time to get one run way open at logan. and so, once they open that run way, they can start to work through the backlog that they have to deal with on sunday and monday. we talked to folks and they said we are trying. it will be a long time for quite a few of of those folks. the sights around here, no more snow. that is good. but the bad news is that this is the stage where it is more dangerous. carbon monoxide is a problem tonight. you have to make sure to clear your vents to make sure you are safe. one child was killed earlier on because he was in a car and the exhaust was blocked up and the father did not realize it in time. those are the stories that we are trying to avoid as we go

through the cleanup stage. we have talked to the power company and they said it will be days before people get the power back on. lows in the single digits. even though the snow has stopped here and they have started to clean up the roads and get the transportation going. it's a long way to grow, craig. >> eric, the fifth snowiest in boston, for a city that sees a lot of snow, that is significant. thank you, sir is. back to politics now, since hillary clinton stepped down from her role of secretary of state, we have not seen or heard from her. it begs the question, is she kicking off retirement in high fashion or resting up for a 2016 run. i want to bring in the brain trust. chloe from feminist sting. pe perry bacon.

and matt welch, we have a nice brain trust, we hope you guys play nicely. chloe, we will start with you, let's break it down. this is according to a brand new poll, let's put up the numbers. you are familiar with these, hillary clinton the most popular politician, i think we have the full screen somewhere. 20 points higher than the vice president, take my word for it, we do not have the full screen. she is wildly popular. could the numbers translate to a win in 2016 or are we using the wrong metric at the wrong time? >> it's important to know that popularity as a noncandidate does not a president make. if we have learned one thing, things like deep rooted racism and sexism takes more than four years to up root. when you think back to the sexism she faced in the 2008

campaign -- >> really? was it widespread? >> is that a serious question? >> yes. >> do you remember the people that stood up and said, iron my shirt? and the criticism she got for showing emotion on the campaign patrol. sexism has not gonna way. >> did i miss the sexism? >> i agree, particularly with the democratic voters. a lot of them are comfortable with a female president. the reason she lost was not because of anything wrong with her. people like barack obama, they liked he was anti-war. that is how i see it. in terms of the poll numbers. she is right, the noncandidate's views. ri condi rice was more popular than bush was. but once hillary clinton gets

back in the field of politics, republicans will remember why they do not like her. and her numbers will go back. the poll does not show that much. >> matt, let's take a look at the president's job approval ratedings. we have those numbers, i understand. the americans are split 46-45 right now in his job approval rating. why can't president obama seem to get over the 50% hump with americans, you think? >> the committee is no good. it has not been good under his watch. >> it's still the economy. >> it's not going to get good soon. americans like him more than they like his policies. you know, he has more of a frie friendly element than a job approval rating. it's surprising that he won re-election so handily. given where the economy is. it's normal, and i don't really think it's going to get better. i think the gap between him and

hillary is that anything will grow, second term presidents have a hard time being popular. >> and it's easier to be popular when you are not on the television every day and you are not in front of senate committees and not in the news. i understand, that it can be, based on previous folks, you sit is at home for a couple of years and your popularity surges. let's talk to -- i would love to go back to talk about what we were a second ago. but we do not have time. i want to talk about president obama capitalizing on his margin with women voters. 52% approval raying with women and 40% with men. why can't the president close the gender gap. ? >> why he cannot close the gender gap? >> yes. >> so here is the thing. i think the discussion that we have had about gender in the united states in the last year. i mean, with legitimate rape

and -- i'm not sure i understand the question. why can't he close the gender gap? >> why is the numbers for approval higher with women and not men? >> i'm curious why you think it's high? >> do you want me to jump in? >> yes. >> women are more likely to be democrat i ci democratic. women are more liberal people. in general, the last several is elections you have seen obama's democratic candidates, obama, john kerry, etcetera have done better among women voters. that is part of what the underlying thi underlying thing is. that is what you are see engine part from the number. >> i think the life of julia, this is sort of a watershed moment of messages. democrats, this is part of what they were doing.

the democratic convention this past year was not about the record the last four years. it was not about economic performance and policy. >> you look like you have got something you want to say. >> well, i want to say is, look, i will be the first to congratulate the person and his administration on making moves on pay equity and a lot of things that mattered to women and anyone who cares about gender equity in the united states, but, again, with the way the republicans have been talking about with gender and women in the last year, it's not so much that they have won women, it's that they did not lose them. i mean, if you cannot win women in this environment, against mourdock, you need to find a new job. >> do you think, it sounds as if at least, you think that perhaps democrats did pandering toward women in the last election. would be that accurate? >> pandering? >> no. >> i think they have better policies. >> better policies. >> i agree.

>> this is fun, we enjoy having here. perry, you are missing out at it. you should be here at the table. we are going to talk about the multi-billion dollar decision to cut saturday delivery. the post master general broke news here. plans that they have added, something new up their sleeve. the place for politics. [ male announcer ] research suggests cell health plays a key role throughout our lives. one a day men's 50+ is a complete multivitamin designed for men's health concerns as we age. it has 7 antioxidants to support cell health. one a day men's 50+. this reduced sodium soup says it may help lower cholesterol, how does it work? you just have to eat it as part of your heart healthy diet. step 1. eat the soup. all those veggies and beans, that's what may help lower your cholesterol and -- well that's easy [ male announcer ] progresso. you gotta taste this soup.

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♪ that'll save the day. ♪ so will bounty select-a-size. it's the smaller powerful sheet. the only one with trap + lock technology. look! one select-a-size sheet of bounty is 50% more absorbent than a full size sheet of the leading ordinary brand. use less. with the small but powerful picker upper, bounty select-a-size. >> six months from now, the post office could get it's way and stop saturday mail delivery. and the change could save $2 billion. will only go into effect if it can get past congress. i will bring in our brain trust. and now, i want to play the clip, this is post master general patrick donahoe, just a few minutes ago, our exclusive interview, he made announcements about the plan for the post

office. >> you will see in some areas we will deliver packages on sunday. starting soon. >> is that going to be it? delivers packages on sunday? >> no, that is not going to be it. i cannot wait for the moment when we can join the 21st century. it will be so excited. we are still talking about the post office losing money. why is the government in the business of business. it should not be in a business that could be competitive if we revoked the post offices monopoly on things and opened it up to competition. it will lose money forever as long as it's in business. it's politicized. if they responded like a business, they could close down a few offices. >> no congressman wants their post office closed. >> right, so we will throw money down the hole. >> so privatize it. >> what about amtrak? >> what about it? >> amtrak is essentially a

government owned monday monopoly. >> there's one line that the profitable and we have both been on it. privatize amtrak and the postal service. >> do the essential services, do the government things. defend the country, let's businesses do other things. >> what is your take on that? is that something you a agree with? >> i grew up in a place that does not have mail delivery on saturday. >> where? >> in australia. >> we do not get mail on saturday, and that is fine. but what is going on here, with the loss of mail on saturday. the post office, say what you will about the efficiency as a business, and i think it's a whole different conversation. say what you will, we are talking about an american icon. mail delivery in the united states is an -- going back is iconic.

and it's -- and in recent years. you know, the post office has lost a little in reputation. >> i have heard some people in green rooms refer to it as the third circle of hell. >> and it's the second largest employer in the country. behind walmart. we should note. lawmakers last night not too happy with how the postal service came to the solution. as you know, congress has not wanted this change to go forward. how do you see the fight itself playing out? >> it sounds like congress will push hard. it's an institution, and congressmen do not like the idea of postal service, it sounds bad, it's something you can campaign against. with the congress, he seemed to have, you know, harry reid, he is not annex pertain in postal service. he said it's a bad idea. they thought about it kafrly and thought that sunday delivery will make more money on packages. they are trying to find a way to

not layoff. the post master general has a plan to sort of gradually reduce spending. and i sort of wish that congress would sort of get out of the way of that. i don't think that they will. >> here is the thing. you know, we should note this. adopting a position on the post office, i will say, that patrick donahoe, has a business degree from m.i.t, he sounds like he knows something about running a business. >> he sounded to me, if tim cook of apple said we are going to stop selling iphones on saturday, i don't think that harry reid would have a statement about it criticizing it and it's the same thing, the post master has a better sense of how the business works. they do not have a great sense of how to do it, since they are losing billions of dollars a year. but they have a better sense than congress does about it. >> we have asked folks out on the sbrnt to facebook and tweet

and send suggestions about ways to fix the post office. we have a lot, and we cannot get to all of them. but this is a guy named aaron grubbs, he said, in part, that proposing the saturday change in order to broaden the scope of the political argument with congress could be an aim. you cannot real read that. trut me that is what it says. it's a tactical move to garner more public supported for streamlining the operation before the idea comes in front of congress. do we think that might be part of the strategy here? the announcement that they were going to stop saturday delivery somehow force congress's hand? >> yes, there's two different strategies at hand. one, if you close on saturday, you have the national park syndrome. if you cut government, make sure the prettiest national park gets closed first. so people say, we are ruining everything in public finance. but there's another thing that republicans are are doing, it's

an accounting move, they are saying the you have to account for your unfunded pension liabilities as if you were a private business. government generally does not do that, they imposed that on the post office, and i wish they would do that throughout government, there's two different politics going on. >> brain trust, you stay there and you stay there as well at home. we will bring you the latest on the nor'easter, that blanketed the bay state. and do democrats have a chance of taking back the house in 2014? we will talk about that as well. you are watching msnbc, the place for weather and politics. around the world that sell stolen identities? >> 30-year-old american man, excellent credit rating. >> announcer: lifelock monitors thousands of these sites 24 hours a day. and if we discover any of our members' data for sale, lifelock is there with the most comprehensive identity theft protection available. [♪...]

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>> the city of boston, right there, under a blanket of snow, just over two feet deep, but that falls short of the all-time score record, some year areas e.

many homes and businesses are still without power right now. house democrats are fresh off of a retreat that featured a 45-minute pep talk by president clinton. will it be smooth sailing for them? let's bring back the brain trust for the last time. perry, let me play for you what former president bill clinton said at the house democrats retreat. take a listen. >> now, that you won this race that was a referendum in large measure on what the american people did not want, we had to create a future that they do want. >> perry, what are the issues that house democrats can win with to possibly take back the house in 2014? >> i think it's very hard to do that, i think they will push gun control and push immigration reform. they will push, you know, a balanced approach, when you talk about deficit reduction and raising taxes on the wealthy.

it's very hard. more people in america. want house democrats. they get 1.5 million more votes than house republicans and yet our congress has 234 republicans and only 201 democrats. the reason that is because of the way districts are drawn. you can pretty much every person that voted for barack obama do so again, it does not matter as much, the district in the next town from you may be packed with republicans and you cannot win that. it's hard for the democrats to win the house because of how the districts are drawn right now. >> take a look at the roll call headline. obama to help house democrats recruit candidates as well. that's the headline, he is set to attend eight fundraisers. president obama, will he help or hurt more, some of the potential house candidates? >> i mean, what else do they have? no, really they are in a bind right now. if you look at the last 13

second term presidents, 12 have had their hat handed to them in the mid term elections. usually by an average of 30 votes. right in their party gets drummed because the second term presidents are not popular. he can lead a fundraiser, that is helpful, people like him. the fundamentals of the democrats are terrible going into 2014. >> i want to talk about hillary clinton again. if she were to hypothetically get the nomination, does she walz into the white house? >> i would like to talk about that, but i want to say something first. it's crucial that obama is pledging to help at the state level, clearly the 2012 election is a mandate for him. and he is capitalizing on that. what is happening in the states where the gop is running everything, it's a nightmare. you only have to look at something like abortion act is ses. when the gop runs the table,

they are stripping abortion access to states out of mississippi, it's legal, but it's not accessible, and because the democrats do not have a lot of power in the states there's nothing they can do about it. 2014 is really important. >> hillary clinton, before we go. >> yes, sir? >> oh, i do think she will get the nomination? i don't know. i would love to tell you yes, but actually do not know, and i think the people that are saying they do know, don't know. >> are you one of those people? >> do i think she gets the nomination? i think if she wants it, i am confident she gets the nomination. that does not make me sound crazy. in terms of who will win the next election. it depends what happens the next four years. if the unploilt employment is 9 will be different. >> you said something a second

ago, you said who else do house democrats have? should democrats at this point be at all concerned that their bench is not as deep as the gop bench? >> absolutley. it's strange, i think hillary clinton is by far the most likely nominee for either party, for presidential nominee in 2016. republicans have a lot of sort of b-candidates, or b manufacture minus candidates. democrats have non. i don't really, is it -- joe biden? i think people are -- >> he is a warrior. >> he is a super happy warrior. he has been running for president for years and he is not going to win. the democrats have a bench problem right now. but they have a clear front-runner. i think. >> today's brain trust, that was fun guys. i do appreciate you guys being here. that sit, that is all we have for our show today, join me here tomorrow. 3:00 eastern, i will be joined

by general mccaffrey, and others, be sure to tune in to msnbc tomorrow morning. "meet the press." we will be talking to dick durbin and eric cantor. keep it here for the latest on the weather throughout the evening and be careful out there folks. we will see you back here tomorrow. ♪ using cloud computing and mobile technology, verizon innovators have developed a projective display for firefighters. allowing them to see through anything. because the world's biggest challenges

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